tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-2736720231951988221.post3008200565429395526..comments2023-10-07T04:07:56.527-04:00Comments on The End Time: The Romanticizing Jesus movement is turning women into camp followersElizabeth Pratahttp://www.blogger.com/profile/04341086233512507156noreply@blogger.comBlogger26125tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-2736720231951988221.post-18954459567429996212018-06-08T16:12:20.016-04:002018-06-08T16:12:20.016-04:00As the hart panteth after the water brooks, so pan...As the hart panteth after the water brooks, so panteth my soul after thee, O God.<br />Psalm 42:1<br />King David said his soul panted after God. Nothing wrong with ano intense longing for the true Presence of the Lord, and yes, some people have a more intimate fellowship with the Lord. But some people are being tricked by seducing spirits into thinking that God is about Eros love, but He is about phileo love, not eros. It's a trick of the enemy. SuzyQhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/10479273465997028630noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-2736720231951988221.post-2181621233675809802016-06-24T11:27:41.798-04:002016-06-24T11:27:41.798-04:00Hello E Taylor,
I agree, the way this is interpre...Hello E Taylor,<br /><br />I agree, the way this is interpreted says a lot about the person. There is a difference between childish faith and child-like faith. Grown women do not "melt into Jesus" as lover, boyfriend or anything of the sort. Songs like those are not aimed at children but to adults, usually women. Writing songs about, listening to, and enjoying relationship with Him in erotic terms does say a lot about a person. Elizabeth Pratahttps://www.blogger.com/profile/04341086233512507156noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-2736720231951988221.post-61577950196637675252016-06-24T11:15:33.215-04:002016-06-24T11:15:33.215-04:00"I wanna sit at your feet
Drink from the cup ..."I wanna sit at your feet<br />Drink from the cup in your hand.<br />Lay back against you and breath, feel your heart beat<br />This love is so deep, it's more than I can stand.<br />I melt in your peace, it's overwhelming"<br /><br />Makes me think of my children when they were young and their desire to be close to me, hold me and heart my heartbeat. <br /><br />I guess the way this is interpreted says a lot about the person. Anonymoushttps://www.blogger.com/profile/14473262613746566586noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-2736720231951988221.post-23390765111846845802016-06-23T23:14:53.804-04:002016-06-23T23:14:53.804-04:00I agree with Song of Sol portraying married love. ...I agree with Song of Sol portraying married love. If we tell a child that sex is better than chocolate, he has no reference point and will not believe us... yet the glory and majesty of heaven far surpasses sex, even if we can't imagine it!<br />Anonymoushttps://www.blogger.com/profile/04879277379823926126noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-2736720231951988221.post-53457980124585910342015-03-12T07:08:17.073-04:002015-03-12T07:08:17.073-04:00Anonymous I wish I could "un-read' the ly...Anonymous I wish I could "un-read' the lyrics to this Casting Crowns song. It's gross.<br /><br />CASTING CROWNS LYRICS<br />"Your Love Is Extravagant"<br /><br />Your love is extravagant<br />Your friendship, it is intimate<br />I feel like moving to the rhythm of Your grace<br />Your fragrance is intoxicating in our secret place<br />Your love is extravagant<br /><br />Spread wide in the arms of Christ is the love that covers sin<br />No greater love have I ever known You considered me a friend<br />Capture my heart again<br /><br />Spread wide in the arms of Christ is the love that covers sin<br />No greater love have I ever known; You considered me a friend<br /><br />Capture my heart again<br />Your love is extravagant<br />Your friendship, it is intimate<br /><br />I wish I could "un-read' these lyrics from Kari Jobe,<br /><br />I wanna sit at your feet<br />Drink from the cup in your hand.<br />Lay back against you and breath, feel your heart beat<br />This love is so deep, it's more than I can stand.<br />I melt in your peace, it's overwhelming <br /><br />It IS gross! So much of our worship musics today and female 'Christian' writing like Ann Voskamp and Sarah Young feature sensuous imagery and sexual language formerly found in pulp romance books. It is disgusting.<br /><br />Song of Solomon is not a picture of sensual and sexual love between Christ and His bride. Read a good commentary on that. Meanwhile here is a synopsis of the S. o S<br /><br />The Song of Solomon is a lyric poem written to extol the virtues of love between a husband and his wife. The poem clearly presents marriage as God’s design. A man and woman are to live together within the context of marriage, loving each other spiritually, emotionally, and physically.<br /><br />This book combats two extremes: asceticism (the denial of all pleasure) and hedonism (the pursuit of only pleasure). The marriage profiled in Song of Solomon is a model of care, commitment, and delight.<br /><br />Read more: http://www.gotquestions.org/Song-of-Solomon.html#ixzz3UATmmADB<br /><br />Here is Pastor Mike Abendroth in a 3-min explanation of the statement "Loving God is not erotic", http://youtu.be/FpnNFhJJvrUElizabeth Pratahttps://www.blogger.com/profile/04341086233512507156noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-2736720231951988221.post-33526366434605394082015-03-12T01:50:41.749-04:002015-03-12T01:50:41.749-04:00Elizabeth, I wish I could "un-read" what...Elizabeth, I wish I could "un-read" what you wrote above here so I can sleep tonight. The OP said she was NOT referring to physical contact with Jesus, yet in your reply you said disgusting things about licking breasts and homosexuality. I'm so beyond grossed out I almost feel sick to my stomach. If you read a good commentary/study on Song of Songs, you will find that the poetic imagery has very symbolic, noble meaning, whether you take it as an allegory about Christ and His Bride or an example of marriage.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-2736720231951988221.post-53272660106626396952014-02-16T13:13:53.455-05:002014-02-16T13:13:53.455-05:00thanks Anonymous. I agree that is disrespectful. G...thanks Anonymous. I agree that is disrespectful. Good point about the handsome man hollywood-actor syndrome.Elizabeth Pratahttps://www.blogger.com/profile/04341086233512507156noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-2736720231951988221.post-29444904573223321962014-02-16T12:52:03.530-05:002014-02-16T12:52:03.530-05:00I have to say, Hollywood seems to have sexy men po...I have to say, Hollywood seems to have sexy men portray our Savior even though it is written in the Bible that he was "not much to look at". Yeshua/Jesus is Jewish and he wore the clothes of a Rabbi and most likely had a long beard. They are focusing on looks rather than our High Priest and His teachings. And near Halloween, stores are filled with items of the occult and - yes - churches are now allowing people to bring their Starbucks coffee to worship service with the excuse "Jesus said, 'come as you are' ". I think that is disrespectful to God. Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-2736720231951988221.post-12681806608164436712012-07-18T07:30:21.493-04:002012-07-18T07:30:21.493-04:00Hi Marrell,
Thank YOU for passing the link along....Hi Marrell,<br /><br />Thank YOU for passing the link along. I went to it right away, thinking all the while of the swap, "Woe to those who call evil good and good evil, who put darkness for light and light for darkness, who put bitter for sweet and sweet for bitter!" Isaiah 5:20. He swapped Holy Truth for erotica, and then likened them as one and the same. Woe to him!<br /><br />As for prophecy, well, one reason they don't see it is because they are scared. Many people who profess to be Christians are afraid of the rapture. Some because they are not really Christians, others because they are attached to this world and want what it has more than they want Jesus.<br /><br />Others are good and solid Christians but are victims of seminaries. A whole generation of pastors and teachers have emerged from seminaries in the last 30-40 years where prophecy simply isn't taught. If it is, it is taught as allegory, with an overt tinge of it being a second rate category of study. As a result, many pastors and teachers have come out of seminaries with little to no training in these verses or little to no understanding of them, or little to no interest in preaching them. So we have a generation of congregants who are learning the same- no interest, no wisdom, no ability to discern the prophetic.<br /><br />Example: No one in Joel Osteen's church is going to understand prophecy. He NEVER teaches the second coming because he, by his own admission, doesn't preach sin, wrath, or anything "negative." There are hundreds of thousands sitting under him over the years. He is a bad example of the above, though, because he never even went to seminary!<br /><br />Another example: No one in Rick Warren's church is going to understand prophecy. He is soft on Muslims, praying to Allah in the name of a false prophet (Isa). <br /><br />The distinct thing about Jesus above all other names is that He has the sole authority to judge, and will come again to do so. Hence the aversion to prophecy of many who profess the one true God.<br /><br />And so on. Prophecy is, to use a phrase, the red-headed step-child of the bible. And no wonder, its power to edify and comfort is great. Its word, when shown to be fulfilled, demonstrate our true God's authority and timelessness. Therefore satan does his best to cast shadows upon what in my opinion are some of the greatest promises of the bibleElizabeth Pratahttps://www.blogger.com/profile/04341086233512507156noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-2736720231951988221.post-78714324069427392172012-07-18T05:41:19.230-04:002012-07-18T05:41:19.230-04:00Yes absoultely! We are indeed sitting ducks. Your ...Yes absoultely! We are indeed sitting ducks. Your example about Satan and Eve is chilling because no one thinks about the depth of that. If Satan could do that to her than what of us? <br /><br />I am so glad you were able to use the link regarding the UK hotel. I thought it was a joke but then realized that in these times (like you) I shouldn't be surprised. Elizabeth, I don't understand why there are so many who cannot see prophecy. It is so apparent in everything that is occuring. Even Christians who are aware of prophecy still doubt. So many are stubbornly and sinfully blind. <br /><br />Thank you for being a discerning watchman. <br />Marrell :)Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-2736720231951988221.post-18252017717558328682012-07-16T08:06:19.583-04:002012-07-16T08:06:19.583-04:00Hi Marrell,
I'm so glad this could help you. ...Hi Marrell,<br /><br />I'm so glad this could help you. I believe that women are targets for satan, constant and perpetual, and this latest iteration is one aspect. I hadn't thought directly about the Mommy Porn trend tying in, but you are absolutely right, it does. Thank you for the link to the news issue about the erotic novel replacing bibles at UK hotel!! I am astounded, ASTOUNDED, but not shocked. The Lord's word told us in the days of the end we would trade good for evil and evil for good. That we would become rebellious and lawless. Oh, my goodness.<br /><br />In the Garden when the serpent tempted Eve, he beguiled her, and when she saw the fruit she saw that it was pleasant. But the Hebrew word for 'pleasant' is explained we see that it means "to desire exceedingly, greedily, intensely". Satan reduced Eve to a slavering, drooling puddle of desire for that fruit. If he can do that to Eve who had no sin-nature in one conversation, and over *fruit*, what will he do to us? We're sitting ducks. And too many women have abdicated their position as warrior, failing to guard their eyes (which is the lamp of the soul) and satan is leading so many women down the path of sinful desire...Elizabeth Pratahttps://www.blogger.com/profile/04341086233512507156noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-2736720231951988221.post-76784249103687055202012-07-16T07:47:31.380-04:002012-07-16T07:47:31.380-04:00This was a very timely post for me because I was w...This was a very timely post for me because I was wondering if women have become targets in the battle and your writing here makes perfect sense. I started thinking about this because of a heavily popular book out now called 50 Shades of Grey, and how women all over the world love this book. I never knew what it was about until I read its description on Amazon; it is pornography at best. I also found out that it replaced bibles in a British hotel. <br /><br />http://www.inquisitr.com/276680/50-shades-of-grey-replaces-bible-at-british-hotel/<br /><br />Thank you for your insightful writing as always in these times<br /><br />MarrellAnonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-2736720231951988221.post-6643633038183447912012-07-15T19:58:39.646-04:002012-07-15T19:58:39.646-04:00I believe it was Augustine who first taught the &q...I believe it was Augustine who first taught the "Christ and the church" metaphor, which then became the Roman Catholic teaching. It stayed with the many protestant denominations after the reformation, which is why it ended up with Scofield. But in the Christian church, it started with Rome.Glenn E. Chatfieldhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/04117405535707961903noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-2736720231951988221.post-91816831100326853382012-07-15T19:52:31.167-04:002012-07-15T19:52:31.167-04:00Bible.org http://bible.org/seriespage/song-songs m...Bible.org http://bible.org/seriespage/song-songs makes a long and precise interpretation of this book, addresses the common misinterpretations, including the Jesus and Bride issue, and concludes (almost) with this:<br /><br />"The Song of Songs vividly and brightly tells us how the bridegroom and the bride rejoice over each other and delight in each other. On the day of our salvation, our Lord and Savior and now Bridegroom will rejoice and delight over us and we in Him. This is what resonates in our spirit as we read the Song of Songs. What makes this different from typology is that we are not actually making identification between the Song of Song’s bridegroom and Jesus. The Song of Songs just helps us to know His heart."<br /><br />I recommend the study. It is one long page.Elizabeth Pratahttps://www.blogger.com/profile/04341086233512507156noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-2736720231951988221.post-31644973536121642682012-07-15T18:50:41.951-04:002012-07-15T18:50:41.951-04:00The interpretation that Song of Solomon is between...The interpretation that Song of Solomon is between Jesus and the Church is NOT just "Romanist". Scofield taught it in his Scofield Study Bible. I have NEVER been a Catholic but was raised from birth on the Scofield Study Bible and that is what I was taught - it's a picture of Jesus (the groom) and His Bride (the Church). I rejected that view when I was about 20, some 37 years ago, along about the same time I quit using a study Bible for my general reading (the notes are not inspired, but many don't understand that!). I believe it is simply a love song between a man and his bride. For further info on Scofield's view (1917 edition), see http://www.baptistboard.com/archive/index.php/t-29338.html <br /> <br />"Scofield's remarks have been deleted in the New Scofield Bible.<br /><br />Scofield’s Introduction to the Song of Solomon is shown below.<br /><br />Source: http://www.studylight.org/com/srn/view.cgi?book=so&chapter=000<br /><br />Nowhere in Scripture does the unspiritual mind tread upon ground so mysterious and incomprehensible as in this book, while the saintliest men and women of the ages have found it a source of pure and exquisite delight. That the love of the divine Bridegroom should follow all the analogies of the marriage relation seems evil only to minds so ascetic that martial desire itself seems to them unholy.<br /><br />The interpretation is twofold: Primarily, the book is the expression of pure marital love as ordained of God in creation, and the vindication of that love as against both asceticism and lust--the two profanations of the holiness of marriage. The secondary and larger interpretation is of Christ, the Son and His heavenly bride, the Church (2*Corinthians 11:1-4 refs)."Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-2736720231951988221.post-64481732324151542942012-07-15T13:44:23.090-04:002012-07-15T13:44:23.090-04:00I'm so glad to hear of His increase in you for...I'm so glad to hear of His increase in you for discernment and maturity! Praise Him, it is ever upward. No matter where we are, He brings us higher.Elizabeth Pratahttps://www.blogger.com/profile/04341086233512507156noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-2736720231951988221.post-18020970555287044572012-07-15T13:41:32.860-04:002012-07-15T13:41:32.860-04:00...and I thought it was just me everytime I hear t......and I thought it was just me everytime I hear the one song that you shared all the words to! I have thought about this many times as I listened to the radio. I thank God that I actually caught it with only the spirit's help. I didn'tt need anyone else to tell me. God's moving me onward and upward and it makes me feel good.<br /><br />KimKimhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/15449934341845326322noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-2736720231951988221.post-8731697774135836752012-07-15T12:21:19.442-04:002012-07-15T12:21:19.442-04:00I don't believe you can read SoS and hear the ...I don't believe you can read SoS and hear the voice of Jesus speaking to the church. Ewwww! Made me laugh out loud that some would say that. Makes me wonder if they actually read it. Not everything is prophetic. Parts of the Bible are actual real life. :)<br />Rebecca St James had a song out that is embarrassing to listen to. You wonder what was going on when she recorded "Desperate for You" with all that moaning going on.LiManoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-2736720231951988221.post-35289103552077172872012-07-15T09:02:27.942-04:002012-07-15T09:02:27.942-04:00Hi Glenn,
Thank you! I hope you and the Piper'...Hi Glenn,<br /><br />Thank you! I hope you and the Piper's Wife have a blessed Sunday. I'm so glad our hope lies in Him.Elizabeth Pratahttps://www.blogger.com/profile/04341086233512507156noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-2736720231951988221.post-70769792631138769672012-07-15T08:55:49.782-04:002012-07-15T08:55:49.782-04:00Excellent post, Elizabeth. And excellent response...Excellent post, Elizabeth. And excellent response to the Song of Songs claim.<br /><br />The idea of the Song of Songs being about Jesus and the Church was just the Romanists copying late Jewish teaching that it as about God and Israel. They thought it was too sexual for young minds and therefore spiritualized it.<br /><br />But the context has nothing to do with anything other than the relationship of two lovers, identified as husband and wife.Glenn E. Chatfieldhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/04117405535707961903noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-2736720231951988221.post-54945319981960332692012-07-15T07:19:16.242-04:002012-07-15T07:19:16.242-04:00Hi Child of God,
Thank you for posing the questio...Hi Child of God,<br /><br />Thank you for posing the question...however you and I disagree that Solomon's Song is a spiritualized Jesus speaking to His bride. According to GotQuestions, "Purpose of Writing: The Song of Solomon is a lyric poem written to extol the virtues of love between a husband and his wife. The poem clearly presents marriage as God’s design. A man and woman are to live together within the context of marriage, loving each other spiritually, emotionally, and physically."<br /><br />If we are to accept that the Song is Jesus singing the virtues of, say, licking our breasts, then that makes Him a polygamist, and a homosexual, if we are to extend the metaphor to the entire Church (Bride). We also have to deal with the verse that says there is no marriage in heaven, and then have to charge Jesus with sin,because if we are married and He is to lovingly caress us (each one of us, all however many billions) then we have to say he is failing to fulfill His husbandly duty if He fails to model the Song on each and every one of the redeemed actual bodies, as Paul charged husbands not to do as 1 Cor 7 states.<br /><br />You see the mess that actualizing the Song to an actual marriage between Jesus and each individual will get us into.<br /><br />MacArthur explains that the Song is "a lengthy poem about courtship and marital love. It is filled with euphemisms and word pictures. Its whole point is gently, subtly, and elegantly to express the emotional and physical intimacy of marital love..."...but... "To interpret this—or any other portion of Scripture—in a purely allegorical fashion is to treat the interpreter's own imagination as more authoritative than the plain meaning of the text." And we have said the plain meaning is a husband a wife in the marital bed- which does not exist in heaven.<br /><br />While there are elements in the Song that foreshadow Jesus's love for His church, I maintain that the veiled imagery of the Song is an ode to the pleasures of the marital bed between a husband and a wife, no more, no less.<br /><br />While we do seek all aspects of Jesus, we need no impute *more* aspects to Him than actually exist in scripture. Sexual imagery of Jesus to His bride, in this case, to each and every human He has redeemed, is going too far, in my opinion.Elizabeth Pratahttps://www.blogger.com/profile/04341086233512507156noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-2736720231951988221.post-40362874662467308352012-07-15T06:48:31.959-04:002012-07-15T06:48:31.959-04:00Hi Lynn,
Thanks for your comment. I thought about...Hi Lynn,<br /><br />Thanks for your comment. I thought about the women weeping openly at some of these functions, too, because I attended a function where this was occurring as well. I even spent a while looking for some photos online, but decided not to post any. They exist though, and the overwhelming emotion that can be engendered, swooning and weeping, 'in love with Jesus' made me more than a little uncomfortable. It even reminds me of the women who swoon at Obama, tearfully fainting at his very presence.Elizabeth Pratahttps://www.blogger.com/profile/04341086233512507156noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-2736720231951988221.post-29929574215399565072012-07-15T03:12:50.088-04:002012-07-15T03:12:50.088-04:00An excellent post. It is heartbreaking to see some...An excellent post. It is heartbreaking to see some in the Church throwing discernment under the bus in search of an emotional high. I heard one of the women you referenced speak at a function I was at and watched women around me weeping openly. I didn't get it and thought the woman was a nut. The great deceiver has convinced them to remove their armor and they have no idea they are vulnerable. Thanks for speaking truth!Lynnhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/08141898284607076353noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-2736720231951988221.post-22009811854113987492012-07-14T22:43:37.223-04:002012-07-14T22:43:37.223-04:00Hi Elizabeth,
This has opened many questions for...Hi Elizabeth, <br /><br />This has opened many questions for me. I will share a few with you. What do you do with Song of Songs? It is very romantic and it is Jesus talking to the church. If marriage is sexual and the joining of a husband and a wife is glorifying to God, the ultimate union, then isn't it the same with Jesus and the church but not on a physical, worldly level, but on a deep more meaningful spiritual level? Since God is love, all the different kinds of love, then how does sexual love fit in? <br /><br />I don't believe, or think it is right to think on God as in a sexual relationship but there are many unanswered questions here. We need to be rounded soldiers, not focusing on just a few aspects of God but all of Him. <br /><br />I couldn't imagine God not loving on me deeper and more fully than my husband ever could. He is my God, my Father, my Saviour, my friend and my husband to be as I am part of the bride of Christ and I anxiously wait for Him to come and bring me to Him along with the other brides that complete His church. <br /><br />Blessings,<br /><><child of Godhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/11635805396738062444noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-2736720231951988221.post-83177432666204531222012-07-14T21:26:19.689-04:002012-07-14T21:26:19.689-04:00Thanks so much Jeff. I really appreciate you check...Thanks so much Jeff. I really appreciate you checking in and also your support.Elizabeth Pratahttps://www.blogger.com/profile/04341086233512507156noreply@blogger.com